Hey, what's going on? This episode is all about podcasting. It's a podcast about podcasting. It's very meta, we're going to be interviewing Adam Adams, he is the creator of Grow Your show.com really awesome business. It's basically the easy button for people that want to start doing podcasts. And I really just pick his brain on how to grow your audience, how to create a customer avatar, how to market your audience, how to really grow your brand, and your show and your business with a podcast. And it's just a really cool episode, we also talk a little bit about real estate, investing life and just making a really good podcast. So I enjoyed doing this. And you guys should really enjoy it, too. So without further ado, here we go. Hello, and welcome to the lion show with your host, your favorite business coach, Robert Lyon. Today, we have the great privilege of talking to Adam Adams. He's a podcaster real estate investor. He's really doing a lot of great work out there. So Adam, why don't you kind of introduce yourself and tell everybody a little bit about who you are and what you're up? Yeah, the short of it is I grew up with a family that was in entrepreneurship and real estate investing. So you already touched on both of those, when you were kind of saying hi to me, but my stepdad, he has land all over Utah, he keeps buying on tax deeds, he's got rentals, he's got agricultural land for the tax benefits, and multifamily and self storage units. So I grew up, you know, snow plowing some of those collecting rents sometimes. And he always wanted me to read the book, Rich Dad, Poor Dad, and maybe a lot of your listeners have already checked out that book. But it was life changing for me, after selling a piece of land that I bought a little cabin lot and making a crazy amount of money. I finally decided read the book Rich Dad Poor Dad, and it made me decide that I've got to have a business as well. So Roberts, big thing is if if I could dissect the whole book, you should make as much money as possible in your business, and and have a real business. And then put all of your extra money toward investments. So that you can be in the B and the i quadrants instead of the E or the S quadrant. So there's four different quadrants. But my point that I'm making is back in 2007, as I read that book, I said, alright, that's what I'm doing, I'm going to invest in multifamily. And I'm going to run the biggest business that I can. Now I change that a little bit, because I only have to work five to 15 hours per week right now. And we have 35 employees and 70 ish clients. And for me, I don't want to get any bigger because if I got bigger than I would have to work more, and we'd have more fires to put out. So I've kind of given up on that dream of having a multibillion dollar enterprise. And I'm just happy being able to pay myself 150% of the biggest salary that I ever wanted when I was growing up. So I'm like you did a really good job of simplifying. I'm sure that wasn't, you know, this wasn't your first one. So I guess the question I'd like to ask you first is, I read that you sold your first podcast. So what was your first podcast kind of about? And what was that kind of process of selling it? Like the podcast was called creative real estate go my goal of why did I have that podcast is because I was doing syndication, which is a creative method for closing on apartment buildings, or like self storage, assisted living, there's you could do other asset classes too. But these apartment buildings that I would close on were anywhere from like $4 million to like $24 million, $11 million, and so on. And when do we close on something like that we have to, we have to do a pretty big downpayment. But we didn't always have that liquid capital. That's a that's a lot of liquid money, three $4 million that you put down as a downpayment. And so what we ended up doing is just kind of partnering with passive investors, we did what's called a private placement memorandum. So the goal of the podcast was to raise private capital to buy these deals. But the biggest problem that there's two things that kind of happen and why I stopped the podcast, why I sold it, one of the problems was that most of the people that were attracted to a podcast called creative real estate, were very poor. They didn't have the money. They creativity was the only way that they could make the creativity was the only way that they could do a deal. So I was attracting the wrong avatar. And I didn't realize it as attracting poor people, but I wanted rich people. I needed people that could easily put one or $200,000 per year into other people's investments. And what I was tracking was people that might only have 1020 30 40,000 Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Some creative real estate but you're right. I mean, that's Yeah, everybody want If the creative deals but the only way to get really good creative deals is to have money to invest to find all the right deals and then be able to get them at a discount price. Yeah, not scraping the bottom of the barrel for the garbage deals that nobody would want. Yeah. So I mentioned that I was I decided to sell it. And that was one of the reasons because I realized I was attracting the wrong avatar, I realized that I was serving the wrong person. And it was incongruent Little did I know. And the second thing that was happening is in 2019. In July of 2019, I became incredibly sure of, I had the feeling. I had a little bit of data to back it up, but it was more of like an emotional feeling where I said, by 2023 2022, or 2023, there's going to be a real estate crash. I don't know why I thought that and I could be inaccurate anyway. Because maybe real estate doesn't crash. It is definitely slowing down as we record this. But I remember saying, Yeah, I did absolutely. My get back to reality. Yeah. So So in 2019. In July, I said, Something's, something's going to happen. It's gone up for too long. I don't want to be holding the, I don't want to musical chairs, I want to make sure I have a seat. You know, I want I don't want to be caught with my pants down. So I asked this mastermind that I'm a part of, what can I do? What should I do? And everybody's like, you've helped so many of us, like people in my mastermind group for free be ranked on our podcast, top 1% We're making shit ton more money than we ever made before. You're really good at it. Why don't you start a podcast agency and I'm like, I just want to do that for fun. And I like ignored them. But in July of 19, I ended up going all in on this podcasting thing, and started grow your show. And then in 2020, I ended up finally selling the other podcast, a podcast about creative real estate. And it was I had like four offers. And some of them were 50 $60,000. But I sold it for much, much less because I wanted, it was like my baby. And so I didn't, I wanted to give it up to to the right person that was going to serve my audience that was doing it for the right reasons, not just that they were going to pay me the most amount of money. I feel bad about that type of integrity that I had, because I could have also used a extra 40 grand, but it could have us Oh, well. Oh, well. It is what it is. So it has a good owner now good host now. And I started another podcast called the podcast on podcasting with a main goal of feeding my company grow your show. So the podcast is kind of like the top of the funnel for my company. And so I serve people for free on the podcast, and then some of them call me. And we do pretty well financially by having that model. Yeah, well, you made it so simple. Like, people don't appreciate the correct way to run a business where you have the one link has all everything you offer on it. And then you have one show feeding into that offer. And then you have one back end with everybody doing that job and you just improve on the product as much as you can. And so, kudos to you for figuring that out. Man. I think that's really cool. So I want to ask a couple more real estate questions. And then we'll just we'll go all out. And podcasting. I you so you're not investing anymore. Are you still buying in Utah? I don't own anything in Utah. I actually the last thing that I owned in Utah was an apartment building that I lost in the crash of 22,008. And so, my my dad, my stepdad still owns tons of stuff out in Utah. When I go and visit, I'll still you know, see the storage units are my actually my little brother, my younger brother. He's trying to buy a house, but He currently lives in a four Plex that my dad owns, too. So it's kind of funny. No, I'm always there. But I don't personally own anything there. I have a couple of houses in Ohio. I've got a couple of apartment buildings in Texas and one apartment building left in Missouri. And that's my whole portfolio. It's about 280 doors total. Pretty big apartment complex. Yeah, well, there's like 112 units. Oh, sorry. There's one left in Atlanta, Atlanta, Georgia. So there's 112 units in Atlanta. There's 86 units in Missouri and there's 68 units left in Texas. I am a passive investor also. So like I do the other side. And I'm invested passively in a in a deal where I don't run it or anything like that. I It just makes small checks like you if you were invested in Pepsi, or Coca Cola or something, or Tesla. So at any rate, that it's 400 units in Dallas. And so some sometimes I feel like telling people I own 400 units in Dallas, just because it sounds a little bit, but I aren't just a passive investor in that. So I put the minimum amount so that I could have a part ownership in that to kind of help with the credibility, but I don't use it enough. Yeah. Does that answer your question? I hope it does. No, I love cool states. I just wanted to hear a little bit about what you got going on. So that's cool, man. And yeah, I think the market is going to come down a little bit. I hope it drops so that you can get some good deals on some new properties. But I mean, that's kind of like the dream. So well, I want to talk about podcasting, man. How do you grow people's podcasts? How do you grow a podcast? You know, what is your thinking? I have tons of theories, but about I'd like to hear what you think Cool? Well, let's, let's start here, because I want it to be memorable for your listener who's an entrepreneur. And if they're starting a podcast, I want them to be remembered this conversation and know exactly what to do. So I'm gonna say, If you build it, they will come is full of shit. So some of us have watched Field of Dreams, I remember being inspired by Field of Dreams. And I remember thinking just by simply building something, you automatically have it. And so it's like, it was so inspirational. But the problem is, many people have built a podcast, and then they get stuck in the 99 percentile, like they get stuck in the bottom 99%. And it never gets the traction that they need. And it's because they believed if you build it, they will come. It's because they believed Hey, just because I simply have a podcast, I am famous, i Everybody knows me, life is easy. So the takeaway of the opposite of if you build it, they will come, you really do have to do a little bit of marketing. So Robert, to answer your question, what makes a successful podcast one of the biggest things that people neglect is adding fuel to the fire. So it's basically like they bought their car, they bought the most beautiful SUV or sports car that they ever wanted there, they finally got their Jeep. And they also have their destination, they want to go from Colorado where I live to Moab, Utah in their Jeep, but they don't put any gas in the tank, they don't have any fuel to the fire. And so they've got the car, they've got the destination, but they don't go anywhere. And so the marketing is that little piece that adds the fuel to the gas tank that allows you to get from point A to point B, just by having the car doesn't mean you're automatically in Moab, you've you've got to add fuel to the tank and maybe you've got to add fuel to the tank twice. I remember last time I went to Moab it cost me frickin like 500 bucks to get there. Because because it was like I had to get gas three times. And it costs like $120. Now to ride your bike. Yeah, yeah. So I don't know is the brow around 500 bucks, I think that I spent to get there and then around the same amount to get home. Right? Yeah. So you've got to remember, it's not just the vehicle and the destination is not just owning the thing. It's not just having the podcast, you've got to put something behind it. And for me, and I share this with our clients, you've got to do some marketing, you've got to let people know because Apple doesn't say, Oh, goody. Let's say you've got a listener named Sarah. Oh, goody. Sarah just started her podcast. I can't believe it. Apple says, I've got to put I've got to make sure she's got a million followers. And then Sarah's like, so happy because out of nowhere, Apple promoted her. And she didn't do anything. It just doesn't happen. Sarah's got to start doing some marketing first, once it takes hold the marketing. Now Apple says Oh, cool. There's something different about Sarah. She's not like the bottom 99% That doesn't get any traction on their own. She's actually doing stuff. Let's go and see if we can put her in front of more people. So it's that marketing piece. That's the biggest piece to allowing for show growth for your podcast. I love it, man. So if we were gonna dissect that marketing piece, what's like your what's your goal? Your go to punch for marketing, like what's the one thing that you've seen that has really worked to help grow your audience or help grow your clients? We do a whole bunch of different things for our clients. And we also coach them to do their own organic stuff. But here's the two big ones that we do. Like there's also there's so much more than this. But the two big that I would say that my company will do you need them both because they do opposite things. We have a private message campaign and we have Facebook ads. These are Both opposite. And what I mean is the Facebook ads are incredibly quick. As soon as you throw that up online, people are clicking that same day. Nice. It all, it happens immediately. As soon as the ads live, you're getting traction. Or if you're not you, you're split testing against something else. And you're putting up a different ad, right. But as soon as that happens, you're getting traction. But it's not necessarily the fastest way to do it's not necessarily the most long, it doesn't have the most longevity is the way to say. So it doesn't mean that all of these people that are clicking on your Facebook ads are going to keep listening on Facebook, some of those people, they will click on the button. So we'll have a call to action on the Facebook ad that basically says Download Now. And all they got to do is push the button either on their phone or on the online. And when they push the button, it, they will subscribe and it'll download like 10 Plus episodes for them. They haven't yet listened. But you're gonna get credit for all these downloads. So it's it's very quick, it happens very, very fast. And you don't know if those guys are listening or not, because some of them, don't listen to podcasts, they're just happened to be on Facebook. This is kind of interesting. But on the opposite end the private message campaigns that we do, we I'll share with you the five things that we're trying to do with the private message campaign because it ends up triggering some algorithms and ranking all of our podcasts clients, we try to get people to follow the podcast and download. And then third is to listen to the podcast very, very important that third one, the fourth is to rate and review. And the fifth is to keep coming back to the show. So they're already downloading, they're already subscribed, they're listening, they rate and reviewed. But they keep coming back to the show when they do all five of those things. It triggers algorithms to boost the podcast and get it ranked. But this strategy is incredibly slow. Because it when we can't just like DM somebody on Facebook or meetup.com or LinkedIn, we can just DM them and say, check out this podcast, we would get flagged as spam. So our private message campaigns are, it's kind of like courting your spouse. When you see somebody you don't just say you're hot, I'm hot, we should make babies together. Don't you think we should get married? Very few people wouldn't slap you for that. And you're gonna get virtually slapped. If your DM campaign is this big, long thing where it's not personal. It's just like, listen to this podcast, listen to this podcast, they're gonna slap you, they're gonna mark you as spam, you're gonna get in trouble your accounts gonna get taken down. So the way that we do it is we might go up to him say that speaking of Jeeps, I saw you driving on that jeep, how long have you had it? Have you taken to Moab, for example? Or you might say, Oh, that's a that's a sweet shirt. Maybe they're wearing a Napa Valley shirt? And you're like, Ah, I was just there last week. That's, it's a nice shirt. Where? How many times have you been? It's a natural conversation, it's a personal conversation. And it's short and sweet. And we're asking questions, instead of telling stuff. We're not just only promoting the podcast over time, as you are getting to know people in the marriage life, eventually you you might say, Hey, we should we should go out to dinner sometime. Or we should go jeeping together some time or whatever it is, let's let's go out let's get to know each other. And that that will lead to kissing and two other things. And eventually you are asking for the proposal. But it takes time. And that's like a private message campaign. If we're if done correctly, it takes a lot of time, maybe 3456 months, in order to get that that person that we started having a conversation with, to finally start downloading episodes from your podcast. And we stay in touch with them, we stay in contact with them. And what we've seen is with a private message campaign, it's harder. But it takes longer. But at the end, it's more long lasting. It's like these relationships where you're actually getting married, for example, and the Facebook ads. It's like, it's it's in your face, it's getting attention. And so I like being able to do both, because we kind of get a combination of them. And we get people to check it out. And we try to it's not always easy. Sometimes it's hard. We try to send the same people that were on the Facebook ads. So for example, we go to LinkedIn. And we will we will pull that whole list of your perfect avatar. So we do this for clients and so we're DMing for your client for another podcaster so as we're doing this, we we download the He's lists of people on LinkedIn. We skip trace them. So now we can also chase them around on Facebook ads, at the same time that we're DMing them on LinkedIn and even Facebook. So they're getting the they're getting it from both directions. That's common. Sorry, on the on the Facebook ads, are you running ads to a private message? Are you running ads to the Apple podcast download or bridge page? Or what do you run ads to? Yeah, well, we haven't that I know of, because I don't run the ads. But I haven't ever heard of him saying that he's running it to a chatbot. Or even just personal messaging, experiment with that, because then yeah, you're gonna make a lot, or you're gonna get the most out of your dollar. Because if they click it, and then they get the download link and the private chat, yeah, he can follow up with them that way. So it made me think about it. Well, we need to have him listen to this episode, because I know he's done that with other types of things. For example, he runs he he does all the ads for this crypto company, as well, like a legit one. There's a lot of scams out there. But a legit crypto company that teaches you how to have a legit crypto, I know it's very hard, very hard to find. At any rate, that's what they do with those ads is they there are the call to action is to message them and to connect with them. I don't think that he's doing that for any of our our clients, because we would have to have somebody probably manage them. And that would take a little bit of extra work as well. And we're already doing dem campaigns. You gotta try some that works. It was just something I was thinking, but I liked it. I like it. Are you running it to their website, though, are you just going straight to like Apple podcasts, usually, it's Apple podcast, or or iTunes. iTunes is very common for us to run things to because you can get, you can get downloads on iTunes, whether you're on an app or just a regular old computer, I can think of the name like desktop, Android, or whatever, and Android computer, if that even exists. But I guess the point that I was trying to make is iTunes is universal. So they can download episodes and listen to episodes. Regardless if they're on a phone or a computer or what brand that is you could just target people that use iPhones. That's a good, that's cool, man, I appreciate you sharing that. So like when I started my podcast? Well, the first first couple of podcasts were just kind of like they were crap quality, but it was just getting it out there. But then I finally started you know, the lion show this show. And I figured out how to do SEO on iTunes. So I could basically rank for any episode or any one word that I wanted, it was really simple back when I started like three years ago, whatever it is, that's all I could rank for any one word I wanted to. So that's how I built my first foundation of the show. And then like I'd say about a year ago, they switched up the iTunes algorithm. So now you can still rank for keywords, but they also watch how many subscribers you're getting every week or something like that. So if you get more subscribers and more listeners, then your your podcast goes to the top. But that was my one tactic that I used to really build this foundation of this show. And it worked like gangbusters for a little while. So I was just kind of shooting from the hip. And I was like, oh, man, I could just rank for all these words, and people will actually listen to what I'm saying. So that's how I started my show. Now what we're doing is we're basically making the show I still have a lot of listeners, a lot of followers, we're doing really good. But we make the video we chop it into little clips, we spam it all over the internet, you know, so, but um, like for your organic tactics, what does that look like for you guys on your end? Like, Facebook ads are great, but what else are you guys do and just for the social media stuff. So for all of our clients that we do the editing and post production for one of the things that it includes, because we try to be the easy button for our clients so that we we might charge a little more than some other companies. It's like 175 for per episode, to do everything that's less than some companies but more than others, one of the things that we do is we create promotional images and audio grams or video grams. So there's, there's these promotional assets that can be shared on in many different ways. So our company actually posts one of these on up to three places for our clients. So the client doesn't have to worry about like they're managing all of their social media and getting these from us and trying to put them up on time, we just automatically log into the account and posted on their social forum or their website wherever they want. So that is one big thing that we do for our organic traffic. Another small thing that we'll do is if they've got a guest on the show, for example, I'm your guest today. And at the end of the episode, you might be able to create like a quote card. Well, let's just pretend like I'm cool enough that I said something profound during this whole this whole interview. And your team found that profound thing that I said they could Create a quote card, and then your team would email it to me, that's what my team does for our clients, like, we'll create that QUOTE CARD, where are the guests had something really cool, then we'll create that, along with some other promotional assets. And instead of you having to send it to your guest, our team automatically logs in and emails it to the guests so that they have that, and they're more inclined to share. Because they look like a badass, you know, I'm like, Oh, my gosh, I said, this profound thing on Robert show, that's excellent. I've got to post this. So I look cool. And so that's what we try to do for our people, it gets them more likely that they will share. What's cool about that is that most of their followers, like for example, if I share this, not all of my listeners on my podcast, and not all of my Facebook, social media following knows about you, I know that it hurts your feelings, you're like, oh, my gosh, his people don't know the most many of them don't. And vice versa. A lot of your people don't know about me, and I'll ball and cry about that, because I want to be famous and all that. But the truth of the matter is, they don't know me. So I call this part Trojan horse marketing, where you just find this creative way. Going back to creative real estate, you find this creative way to hack in to the town of Troy, with your Trojan horse to be able to add content and value to Roberts listener. And now one or two of the people that listen to you, maybe 100 of them, who knows the number that they might join the podcast on podcasting, and my listener will go up because of it. And same thing if like you're on my show, and I create something where you sound like a badass little quote card or audio gram or video gram, maybe you'll share it on your Instagram or your your Facebook, your your LinkedIn or something like that. And a few of those people will check out the podcast and they'll get credit for some of those downloads. And maybe a couple of them will stick with my podcast when you're sharing how cool you look. So that's kind of some of the organic stuff that we do. But actually, Robert, honest thing I would like to talk to you about the SEO stuff, like, genuinely would probably like to pay you to look at all of our clients to see if you can add something to making sure that they get ranked for keywords as well. So legit, I really mean that. And I hope we can talk about that today. I yeah, I went super, I got so nerdy down the rabbit hole to figure that out. It's not something we've, we we try to do SEO. You know, like we try to have keywords so people can search for stuff. But I think that you're taking that part to a different level, and you have a lot of experience. So we'd definitely like to see if you can partner with us to even improve where our clients are already are. Yeah, that'd be great. I would love to do that. So I got some questions for you. So I interviewed another podcast and guy, I don't know, there was like, pretty much like this weekend or something like that. He says that they're putting out a podcast every single day. So I'm just wondering like, that's a lot, man. Yeah. What do you see as a good cadence? Or what do you what is your thoughts about do you think it's more is better? Or just kind of what do you think now? More is better? Yes. Unless it shit, if you're just putting out a bunch of shit, then it's just bad. But it doesn't matter. Yeah. So but more is definitely generally better. As long as it's good content like you like you. The mic that you're using in the mic that I'm using is the same mic. You can't see mine in your thing. But it's these are great mics. It's a great audio quality, we're both wearing headphones. So the sound for the listener right now is very, very good. It doesn't sound like this, you know, it doesn't sound like all of this. And I just did a great interview with a guy and he was like, man would have been so good if I could just hear what he was saying. But yeah, it happens. So so good. Sound quality, good content. I think, you know, one of the things that we did in the beginning, you did that was really, really good is you basically asked me, Adam, what do you desire to give to my listener? Like what, what? And that takes me to thinking in a different way that that makes me stop thinking about promoting myself promoting my business, making sure all of your listeners become my client or whatever, right? It switches it so that I can that I'm here to add value. So that question that you did in the beginning, perfect. And then you remember my response is, who is your listener? What are they going through? what do what do they need? How do you serve them? And we talked about how your listener is an entrepreneur, they're looking for growth. They're looking to scale that they're looking to get, be able to find new ways of growing their business. And so now I'm now I'm able because I asked that question, I'm like, Okay, this is who I'm speaking Seeing with and everybody's audience is a little bit different. So as each and every time if somebody ever asked me that great question you asked, What do you want to give? I have to say, well, who is it? What do they need? And then I will try to I'll try to come from a given place. So I think that's a key point for any podcaster. Anybody who's an entrepreneur, and we'll start a podcast is to be thoughtful. And you could go as far as creating an avatar like whoever that entrepreneur is that is looking to grow. We will go back to Sarah, I think we had a had had a female named Sarah, that was an entrepreneur that was starting her podcast earlier today on this call. Well, if Sarah is our perfect avatar, then we get a picture of Sarah. We know how old Sarah is. If she's single, married, has kids. We know what type of job she has. It's just you work at night. So she worked in the morning? Is Is she a single mom? Is she worried about XYZ? Does she want to invest in real estate? Does she How big is her business? Is she a solopreneur? She's the only one and she's wearing all the hats? Is she struggling with that? Or does she have 20 employees? 80 employees, we figure out Sara, we get to know Sarah, we learn who she is, what she needs, what she's going through. And she's we've got a picture of her on. And I hope our wife doesn't get mad that we've got a picture of Sarah Hawk on our screen right there. But we have her in mind. So that every question, Robert asks Adam today, that avatar, whomever it is, whatever his or her name is, that question benefits, the avatar, not just the host, for example, I don't want to get too long winded but this is important. It is a lot of when I started my podcast, the old one creative real estate I didn't have I might have had my avatar in mind. But I wasn't actually being as intentional as I could because the name of my podcast was wrong. The people that I brought onto my podcast didn't serve my avatar. My avatars name was Siva, similar to Sarah Siva Venugopal. Lin is 42 year old male Indian engineer with three kids who lives in New Jersey, and is a bridge engineer, and is an Indian. And I know everything about this guy, what he's worried about how much money he has, what type of job he has, how much he wants to work. And so I put I have that person in mind. And back then, I was just creating content and asking questions that I wanted to know. I wasn't serving Siva, I wasn't helping Siva, I wasn't making Steven need to listen to my podcast, I had this idea of one thing, but I wasn't intentional about it. And I think that's a big differentiator as we're starting podcasts, we need to know who that avatar is so good on you for asking me and good on me for like wanting to know who is this so that can really try to give content that's beneficial for that person? Yeah. I mean, just with with your show, you know, the podcast about podcasting. Like you're just very intentional, and that you did a really good job of it. I want to ask you, you know, how did you do that? But it's like, how did you get so intentional? How did you decide to like simplify it down to like, this is exactly it. I mean, it goes back to you create your customer avatar, and then you figure out how to create the best show for that specific person. And then you just build like that? Is that kind of how you think about it? 100% Yep, every guest that I have needs to help my avatar, every piece of content that I have, needs to help my avatar, every topic, every title, and all of the show notes, need to attract that avatar. And that is critically important that we are intentional from at every point in the game. And then we'll back to the cadence thing. So I think you got to put out a podcast and then you really need to spend like the whole next day. Oh, bro, I forgot the cadence thing. Oh, no, you're good. All right. A long time ago, I was speaking at somebody's conference. I was in the I was backstage, not yet going on. And the person hosting the conference was on stage. And he was taking questions because it was right at the end. And this lady raised her hand. This guy's name is Joe Fairless. He's got a real estate podcast. And it's called the best real estate investing advice ever show for the longest name ever. And then he hosts the best ever conference as well. So Joe was up. He's got a daily podcast, you were talking about how you know that other podcaster was talking about more is better and do well to do 11 days a week, one out every day. So it's hardcore personal development guy and I was like, damn. So there's this woman who raises her hand and asked Joe Fairless Joe, if you had to start all over again, would you still do a daily podcast question mark and Joe thought about it for about two seconds. And he said, No, if I did it all over again, you'll never guess what he says, I would do a twice daily podcast. So the point that I'm trying to make is, the more the better. The higher the cadence, the better. The minimum absolute smallest that I would recommend to any client. In fact, I don't even have smaller packages. Yeah, is a weekly, once per week, that's the smallest. And I don't serve anybody who does 14 a week. But we have a couple of clients that are doing five and seven a week. And I've noticed that the more content that people create it, as long as it's good content, not shitty stuff that they're just thrown out. The more likely that people can listen, can be binge listening, don't have to go to a different podcast because they get plenty of content here. They there's more shareable content, there's more frequently that they're going to be able to have a takeaways and be able to share it with their friends or forward forwarded to other people. And additionally, because of the way the RSS feed, if your listener doesn't know what RSS feed means, doesn't really matter. They can type it down to learn. But the point is, there's all these RSS feed where they go. And every time you basically update your podcast by getting a new episode. Everywhere that syndicated not syndication, like my like the real estate stuff we talked about. But it's syndicated, it pushes the RSS feed to all these different playing platforms. Yeah, every time you publish a new episode, an RSS feed gets updated in all of those places. The thing is that you've become again, front and center and in front of your listener again. And so it that happens more, even if you're just doing twice a week, instead of once a week, you're in front of the listener, you're front and center top left, your podcast shows up through RSS feed on any of the platforms, Apple, Stitcher, et cetera, et shows up more frequently, twice as frequently. And so if it's coming on Monday and Thursday, for example, then if they're logging in on a Thursday or something like that, then they're going to be able to see you more up closer, even on a Friday, they're going to still see you at the top, instead of like hidden on second page of Google. So there's a lot of benefits why Joe Fairless said he would switch from daily to twice daily, more intense level, the big focus. I was doing six a week for a very long time. Yeah. And, and we got up to a couple 100 episodes. And I said, I think we can chill, I think we can hold back for a little while. And so I let my listener know, we're gonna go down to two a week, one solo and one interview each week, and the podcast is still at a good strength. And when I'm able, when I want to work a little bit more hours, I can jump back up to four a week or six a week. But we did, we did six a week for a long period of time and ended up really helping us. That's cool. I needed to know that I guess because like I could put out an episode every single day. But I feel like I need to a whole day just to promote it properly, just because I have like my little checklist that I got to do for each frickin episode just to make sure everyone sees it, you know. But that brings us into the next. The next question I have for you is like who like for the listener out there is going to start a podcast, you know, who should they hire first for their podcast team? Or what? What do you think about like, yeah, what's your first hire, if you're trying to really blow up your podcast, if you're going to launch a brand new podcast, then I actually would recommend my company. Like I hate to sound like a selfish asshole who can do it all lions are sounding but the point that I'm trying to make on who you should hire, if you're launching a podcast, you probably need a consultant who's who's had some success. That's one of the things. Number two, you probably want to be the star of your show only. You don't want to probably wear all of the hats to marketing and editing and post production and writing show notes. And creating creatives and emailing the guest and doing your social, you probably don't want to have to focus on all that you probably are going to make more money in your company. If you just focus on pressing record and letting somebody else handle the rest. So just depends if you've got the budget for it, I would hire a consultant. And I would hire somebody to do all the editing and probably hire somebody to do the marketing. What's good about our company is that we do all of those things so that it could be really beneficial for somebody. But those three things if you're launching a brand new podcast, that's what I would say we probably want all of it. If you have had a podcast for a long time, and you're ready to hire something. It's I would, if I were you, I'd look at either you probably don't need so much consulting, if you've been doing it for a year or two, you kind of know what you're doing. you've kind of been doing it for a little while. But I do think that having somebody edit all of your stuff and promote it, it can be really helpful. So those two things I would say, but um, there's a lot of different people that can mark it. There's a lot of different consultants. And there's a lot of people that can edit. We're just kind of like a one stop shop, which is why I mentioned easy button. Yeah, the easy button. Before the I wrote unintentional quantity, and I'm going to add, like consulting on there. And I think that's the recipe for a really good podcast, you know, getting a get someone to tell you like, what you should do kind of doing, figure out the intentional purpose of your podcast, you know, and then just make a shitload episodes that are really good for your customer avatar, and you're gonna, you're gonna see some action, you're gonna get some traction. Again, I want to ask you, how do you engage more with your audience? Like, because we've got a big audience, not necessarily getting, you know, like, because I like to pick people's brains. I wish I knew more questions. I think that the recipe is, you know, create, like a free community or something like that. But I kind of want to know, what do you think? How do you really kind of get in contact with your audience, so you know a little bit more about what they're doing? So there's really two answers to this. There's How does Adam engage with Adams audience? And how do people engage with people's audience? For me, personally, I invite my listener, to be a guest on my show, one of my calls to action, because it's my perfect avatar. So how do I engage with my audience is I interviewed them on my show, and I add value to them on my show, smart and they feel they feel like they got that value, it was good for them to get the exposure because we have a decent amount of listener base. And, and then they get to know me like we're, we're face to face, for example. I want to hire you, Robert, to help me with SEO for all of our clients. Yeah, that never would have happened if you didn't interview me on your show. Yeah. And so I interview I interview podcasters on my show, and some of them might end up working with our company, either for marketing or editing or something like that. Just consulting. Who knows. So that's how I engage with my audience, how others can engage with their audience depends on who they are and how they are and what they're looking for. But if it's, if it's somebody in the real estate space, that wants to bring on passive investors, they would say maybe they could do a similar thing where they're on their show. And they say, by the way, I'm looking to interview a couple more people that have done some passive investing, or are looking for passive investing. Here's how you could do that. You could either come and tell me your experiences of how you've invested. And people could learn from that. Or if you're nervous, you haven't started yet, but you've got the money and you want to do it, you can come on. And you can ask me, it could be a reverse interview, where you asked me these things, and other people that want to be passive ly invested in syndication or something would be able to learn and grow from our interview. So it could benefit everybody, and also give you a bit more exposure. And so now you've got people that already listened that are that are calling you to do that. So that's just a couple of examples. But I'll share the most common way that I think those ways that I was talking about just now are kind of sneaky ways. But the more it works, yeah, the more common, the more common way would be a lead magnet. Yeah. So here's a couple of examples. If you have an evergreen webinar, that plays once a month that you just recorded once or if you just do webinars once a month, you could say, go to my website.com, grow your show.com forward slash webinar. Now you guys don't have to go to that because I don't actually have that. But you could create something where it's your website.com forward slash webinar. And that could be a repeating monthly recurring webinar, where you always are hosting. This is a good lead magnet because it adds value. You connect your in person with them. And plus, you get their email so big when they sign up for like your zoom webinar or what however you do your webinar, you will generally get their name ioz add their phone number to and then you'll get their email. So these are the required questions when they're signing up for the web. That webinar. A couple of other options for types of lead magnets would be for example, going back to the passive investing thing. Maybe you will create a PDF that helps somebody protect their money when investing passively. So it helps them vet the operator or vet the market that the property is in or vet the property itself on what to look for the roof the drain. edged, the unit mix of its one bedrooms, two bedrooms, three bedrooms, the city, the crime, the schools, it teaches them how to protect their money. So you've got this PDF that you've created, that adds a shit ton of value to your perfect avatar. And then you just let them have it for free. And all they do is download it, they go to your website, and then I've got a whole bunch of lead magnets on our website. For example, you can go, you actually could do this go to grow your show.com forward slash, templates, templates. And so these are, there's like 12 different templates that we have four podcasters. So for example, you've got one how to sell a podcast, that the contract that I paid my attorney to get that contract to sell, we've saved it and templatized it so other people could sell their podcasts, we've also got things for hiring virtual assistants. So it's a template of a contract with a VA because I have a lot of virtual assistants, we've perfected it, and we just give it away. And we've got other things that could be valuable to a podcaster on there as well. So there's all these different templates. And they can just go there put in their email, and their name. And they basically get emailed all of these templates. So these are ways of connecting with the audience webinars, having them come on your show, or having them download your PDFs. I got two questions, though, that I asked everybody that comes on the show. And so the first question, you know, it kind of catches people a little off guard, but I'm writing a book about money. So I just want to know, do you have any tips for the listeners or anyone out there either? How to make more money, how to have a better relationship with money? Or how to lose less money? You know, just any any philosophy on it? Yes, well, two things one, and a huge one is how much money you make is there's a barometer that us humans have, where we believe that we're entitled to a certain amount of money, and no more than that. And we have to remember, specifically that if we, if we want anything above this fictitious glass ceiling that we've put, we've got to break through it just by believing that it's fine. There was a time in my life that I thought 10k A month was insane. All my none of my friends made that at the time. And I want to 10k a month now I pay myself way more than 10k a month. And it only came because I I switched that barometer, I, I changed that gauge so that I was comfortable making more. This is a lot of us hold ourselves back. We say I'm, I'm a bad person, because I'm making a certain amount of money. Oh, that's too much money for me. And we literally hold ourselves back. So that barometer ideas is a big one. Another one is it just comes from Zig Ziglar I think it's that you'll have, you will make as much money as you want. If you help enough, other people get what they want. And so for example, like on our on our podcast on the content that we produced throughout our business by serving clients, I am currently serving 70 Plus podcasters. That's a lot of me adding value to my team adding value to other people. And through that value that I add, I'm naturally getting compensated for it. So Zig Ziglar, I believe said, You'll, you'll get everything in life that you want. If you help enough other people get what they want. I'm trying to help these podcasters grow. I'm trying to help them have the easy button. I'm trying to help them have a successful podcast, and then making money. And in exchange, my team pulls in a decent amount per month and I can pay myself a decent amount. So it's just a way to think about it. You got to help more people. You got to help people at a higher level. I love that man. And then the last question is what motivates you? What really gets you fired up and taking action? I'm weird because I get motivated for different reasons that I don't know if everybody would I just I want to help people like I love people I care about people, I want to add the best amount of content. I think it's something like contribution is like this. One of the six human needs I think it is and once some of the others are kind of in place contribution becomes something that's a big one. For me, that's really what motivates me. I just want to contribute to society into the world and to other podcasters into my kids I want to give I want to be generous and just the other day some a friend posted a they had a what is it? Something that you could you could just donate to it And it made me feel super good. Now I'm a little competitive. So this is going to make me sound like an ass, I'm sure. But it made me sound feel really, really good that I contributed more than anyone else. I saw a whole bunch of like attorneys, and a couple doctors, but a whole bunch of attorneys because this person's a judge. And so they know a lot of like criminal defense attorneys and stuff like that. And I know that these attorneys make great money. I know that a lot of them save a lot of money. They're probably making 20 grand a month or more. And I contributed more than any of them and and yes, in a way, I was happy and proud that I that I could say that. But also it just made me feel honored to do it without worrying without a care. So just that contribution is a huge thing to me. I love it. Oh, we've gone deep news. This is a great episode. So I really appreciate it. Any last thoughts before we wrap it up? Just remember, if you build it, they won't come. The last thought that I'll share is ready fire aim, not what everybody else has been telling you. Everybody else is saying. Ready, aim. Ready, fire aim. I'm saying Ready, Aim. Fire. Ready, Aim Fire. Take the time to figure out the beginning with the end in mind, understand what your purpose is, who your avatar is, and add that value to those people to your avatar. And if you do it with intention, Ready, Aim Fire. You'll get a lot better results than just starting just just not overthinking it. I want you to overthink it a little bit when you're starting a podcast. Yeah, be intentional and then make two episodes a day. Two a day. Yeah, at least one a week but as many as you can feasibly maintain. Yeah, that'll get you towards mastery a lot quicker. Right. Thanks, everybody for listening for Be sure to like, share, subscribe. We got all the links in the show notes. What's your website one more time. Grow your show? Your show. So if you're looking to boost your podcasts or start a badass podcast, be sure to check that out. Thanks for coming on Adam. And thanks everybody listen to talk to you the next one